An interesting point. I think that if you aren't a farmer or have space to grow your own food that there is definately a premium price attached to organic foods. Perhaps that is why this type of choice is really only accessible to the upper class? Even just deciding to eat a mostly fresh food diet (i.e. no processed foods) can be really expensive in comparison to eating more processed foods. So that begs a further question, I think, is healthy living a premium lifestyle? Shouldn't we be working to organize our society in such a way that the healthiest choices are the cheapest/easiest? Especially since we all pay into the medicare program?

I think there is a lot of truth to this. Have you been in a Whole Foods lately? Christ. But yes, everything from certified organic dog food to LEED certifications cost $$$ -- and the interesting thing is, it transcends party lines. "Green" IS the prerogative of the people that can afford it, however they vote.

I read an interesting article recently that profiled a group of the "working poor" and one of these things they said that lends credence to this argument is how they ignore the "organic" section of their supermarket, because of the prices. And as Kelbel implies, ingesting the cheaper processed foods day in and day out is likely going to lead to health problems -- that they may not be able to afford to treat, because of poor insurance or no insurance -- and this costs all of us.

I live in the most fucked state in the US right now in regards to this issue. Seriously, it is fucking third-world here right now. We have a state government that's threatening to yank funding for health care and education ... there are people whose ability to survive is seriously imperiled, and they might be some of the same people sweeping up the breakage at the Whole Foods they can't afford to shop at (or even live within an hour bus ride of).

And no place in the world is more garishly "green", either ... and by garish I mean people tearing down perfectly good homes to build a new "green" home in its place ...people having the gall to charge premium prices for the most basic foods, on the presumption that they meet certain criteria ... and of course, the lifestylers that are sanctimonious about their tastes, and forget that they live in a world where people are still thankfully free to make their own choices -- and do/eat things because they happen to like them, not should.

There's a lot of options out here, sure ... but in the green world, the high road is an expensive one, and the people who are so self-righteous about it would be well-served to consider solutions to accessing their precious lifestyle in (yes) sustainable ways. How can we either 1. make these good cheaper or 2. help people's ability to buy them?

The yuppie greens seem to have an almost trickle-down economics mentality to the green lifestyle, and seem somewhat emboldened even by its exclusivity. In my opinion, no top-down economic structure works -- the only thing you can construct from the top down is a hole. And the people at the bottom already have plenty of those.

To your point J Ryan, are you suggesting the organic trend that's taken favor with the highest entry point consumers won't become tomorrows Krispy Kreme for the masses as every other phase of American living becomes?

Does it really come down to capitalism? Does the promise of green living artificially inflate the price of plain old garden variety gardens?

I have started to think on some very low background noise level that green is really getting crammed down my throat personally and I'm not sure who the driver is . . . One phrase that comes to mind is 'mass hypnosis' - It's as if we're all caught up in our love of soylent green and spreading the word of it as if it's a valued secret . . .

I can't put my finger on it but it does feel genuinely like a trend (like 80s clothes) - Right now in our time, it really feels like it's just the thing you SHOULD do just like peglegging your jeans did back in the 80s . . . I'm not sure why it feels so exceptionally common or expected and that bothers me a great deal . . .

BTW, my brother from Atlanta informs me the correct name of the grocery store you refer to is "Whole Paycheck"

Disco

Disco,

I don't know, because Krispy Kreme wasn't rooted an ideology or lifestyle -- it was a pure, whimsical infatuation with something useless, like the other example you give, peglegging jeans. Like a lot of things without discernible logic or purpose beyond "everyone is doing it" those trends cannot evolve into something useful or substantial.

There is hope for "green." While aspects of it are certainly trendy, pointless, or manifesting in obvious conspicuous consumption ... it's a "movement" rooted in a good idea, once you cut out all the bullshit.

There's just so much of the bullshit out there it makes you want to take a weed-whacker to *everything* green, useful or not.

I know someone who is an editor at the LA Times who's told me it more or less takes every fiber of being to keep from going apeshit on writers who pitch a story to them with the word "Green" in it, particularly a "Green "

He basically has to tell himself, "I'm going to forget that they ever said that in order to keep my respect for them as a writer."

To sum up, I hope the general ideas behind the "green" movement outlive its currently crass and classist merchandising -- therein lies the trend. And I believe it will. One day, "green" or "eco-" things will be tolerable, but by then they'll probably be called something else, or have no special branding indicator attached at all. One can dream.

Damn, I shouldn't have used parentheses. The phrase in quotes up there, at the end of the third-to-last paragraph, should read "Green Holiday".

And I LOVE "Whole Paycheck." I am going to use that.

For my own part, I shop at Trader Joe's, the local Co-Op, and at Ralph's with The Dude. Whole Foods is scary.

Whole Paycheck is awesome. It's hipper than a Ramones t-shirt fucking a dragon. I go there for tattoo research. (no wait, the NZ lamb shanks are heaps better there than I can get here, export quality and such. considerably un-green by any definition though.)

I don't think we talked enough about the snobbery aspect of the "greenery". Snobbery, by and by, is purely superficial and has no bearing on the merits of whatever is being snobbed-up. It is just people being dicks and projecting their opinion across the masses.

"Greening" shit, while rooted in a good concept, is too often a way to get people to shell out more money for more stuff but it's not inherently snob-inducing. Prone to snobbery, yes, but so are many things is the wide wide world. Music, art, cars, education, architecture, booze. I have been known to snob some music up... once in a while.

So what takes "being into something" up to snobbery levels? Being out of the reach of the lower class or being a fad/trend doesn't make make these things snobberific. Caribbean cruises are out of reach for most but I have never though of them as endeavors for snobs. Totally, like, spending this crazy, intense week with a tribe in Guatemala, that has a pretty dang high snob potential.

hmmmm. Ok, I would say, within the umbrella of "green", recycling is not something people get all snobby about or are perceived to be snobs about. Is it because it has reached some critical mass where it is so mainstream that if you don't recycle you are just considered a dumbass? There are recycling programs in almost every neighborhood, true? If it had reached this tipping point (I think it has) then people don't get all preachy about it.

Organic this and free-range that are things that people, and more importantly marketers, preach about. People don't like getting preached to... except for an hour on Sundays. (By that I mean listening to the Oxpod.) Snobs and preaching are part and parcel, right? I say so. Stop the preaching and stop the snob perhaps. (sneering is a form of preaching in my book). Also snobbing over and preaching about "needs" instead of "wants" is a bigger can of organic-free range worms.

Yeah, I am going to stick with my critical mass theory as being the key to snobbery. Oh, here is another example. So Jamie Oliver, bish bash bosh, had a huge crusade against battery farmed chicken eggs in the UK. That would smack of snobbery in the States, and did so in the UK until he convinced Sainsbury's (one of the largest supermarket chains.) to stop carrying battery eggs. Now in the normal aisle of the normal super market there are "green" eggs. No snobbery or premium pricing attached.

And you are all oxsnobs.

Oh, Disco, are there font snobs? Do guys in the industry wretch when they see Comic Sans?

I like your thoughts Human Man and agree we've left the snobbery discussion but you make a fine point in your second paragraph . . .

I also agree there is no snobbery associated with recycling or composting for that matter, you're turning your poo into fertalizer, there's just no way to get uppity about humanure . . .

You also make a good point that when we were kids growing up, we were simply ignorant to recycling, totally ignorant but in today's world there is no question if you ain't doing your part, you are judged a total dumbass and I was recent witness to this last weekend . . .

I digress, to return to J Ryan's earlier points, I think you're correct, it is a branding thing that's happening right now and it isn't always so sweet smelling . . . Point in fact, both kids got an Arby's Kid's Meal this evening that came with 'Eco' branded fun gadgets to help them learn about how to save the planet . . . Well, somebody forgot to tell the dumb ass in marketing NOT to mold them out of plastic then double bag them in clear plastic bags!

I think this is mostly where I have the disconnect . . .

'Going Green' isn't any different than eating 'Reduced Fat' foods and proselytizing green living or local eating I don't believe is the purpose for practicing such a lifestyle . . .

Lastly, to set the record straight, us guys in the font industry are ambivalent to Comic Sans because we know the hate campaign elevates the awareness that our profession exists, so we can't hate it for that and as a typeface goes, it solves the problem that it was intended to solve, so we can't hate it for that, so what can we hate Comic Sans for? I have no personal ill will against Vincent Connaire . . . I certainly see the font used a lot, but again I also see my Fontdinerdotcom Sparkly font used a lot and in some circles, it has become the Comic Sans of Retro Fonts, so I can't sit in judgement of an otherwise respectable font making effort that has become part of popular culture . . . I mean think of it . . . In this whole guy's life, his great great great grandchildren will always be able to point to him as the creator of Comic Sans and people will immediately know what they're talking about . . . I'm not sure that's the worst legacy in the world to leave but it isn't likely what most people may want to be known for in their lifetime . . . But the funny thing about fontmaking is that it has a VERY VERY VERY long memory so any effort you create stays forever in the digital world never to be forgotten. . .

Disco Stu :D

Holy crack, I didn't know there was an actual anti-Comic Sans movement. I was just throwing spaghetti against the wall as a crappy joke. Good to know though. I was checking out some websites after Disco wrote about it. I also like the parallels between Connaire and the "simple farmers who grow the food and eat it themselves" from your first post. Good stuff.

Joining the discussion late...

But regarding recycling and being made to feel like a dumbass.... well, not in the South. In fact it's the opposite. There are no public recycling programs (at least in Savannah), and those who do want to recycle have to travel many miles for drop off stations, as there are only something like 4 in the whole metro area.

Moreover, when I asked where I should put cans/bottles, I was laughed at, as if recycling was some absurd notion. In fact, once, when it was brought up (not by me), it was reacted to as the mere concept were obscene, and an affront to God. Seriously.

To quote the venerable Pat McCurdy:
God made plants and trees,
We can waste them as we please.